Tiki taka football

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

Well it has been reasonably successful to date. Wouldnt you say?

Abubakr

2013-04-24 01:37:19 UTC

Post by Jellore

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

Well it has been reasonably successful to date. Wouldnt you say?

No it hasn't. It was the quality of the players. All you have to do is
gather the best eleven players around and throw them on the pitch and
results will follow. There's no place for tactics in this game, way
overrated aspect of the sport. I'm Italian btw (admittedly of the clueless
about the game variety. Yes, there are those too!).

Diabolik

2013-04-24 02:00:37 UTC

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?
Well it has been reasonably successful to date. Wouldnt you say?

I would say Barca have some great players, and Spain. That's why they win;)

When a team has 66% possession and still loses 4-0, it's obvious.

Abubakr

2013-04-24 01:33:41 UTC

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

Are you going to come out with this nonsense every time Barcelona lose a
match now?

(The answer is obviously, neither, since both were present but the result
was a loss).

Diabolik

2013-04-24 02:03:32 UTC

Post by Abubakr

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

Are you going to come out with this nonsense every time Barcelona lose a
match now?
(The answer is obviously, neither, since both were present but the result
was a loss).

When a team has 66% possession and still loses 4-0, it's obvious.

Mark V.

2013-04-24 01:45:07 UTC

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

Instead of trolling, why not raise a pint of Schpaten Münchner Hell with Sven to celebrate today's win!

Bruce D. Scott

2013-04-24 10:32:15 UTC

Mark V. <***@gmail.com> wrote:

|> Instead of trolling, why not raise a pint of Schpaten M?nchner Hell with Sven to celebrate today's win!

That's a great pun in English. Sven got it of course :-)

--
ciao,
Bruce

drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/

Alkamista

2013-04-24 03:16:56 UTC

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

You need quality to be able to play tiki taka.

Diabolik

2013-04-24 04:01:32 UTC

Ok, but quality can win regardless of tiki taka, like Bayern and RM do.

Abubakr

2013-04-24 04:34:21 UTC

Ok, but quality can win regardless of tiki taka, like Bayern and RM do.

Yes, it is possible to win without tika taka. It's possible to win without
even much "quality" let alone tiki taka. What kind of drugs are you on,
seriously?

The Scrutineer

2013-04-24 04:49:56 UTC

Ok, but quality can win regardless of tiki taka, like Bayern and RM do.
Yes, it is possible to win without tika taka. It's possible to win without
even much "quality" let alone tiki taka. What kind of drugs are you on,
seriously?

It would have been a complete waste of time if Bayern don't go on and win
it... Barce have won three times since 06, they have nothing to prove with
the way they play!!!

Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did and
get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't negative
by any means!!!

Tiki take has won three UCL titles, Two Euro's and a World Cup in the last
6/7 years, no argument can be made against it's successfulness!!!

Abubakr

2013-04-24 04:53:40 UTC

Ok, but quality can win regardless of tiki taka, like Bayern and RM do.
Yes, it is possible to win without tika taka. It's possible to win
without even much "quality" let alone tiki taka. What kind of drugs
are you on, seriously?

It would have been a complete waste of time if Bayern don't go on and
win it... Barce have won three times since 06, they have nothing to
prove with the way they play!!!
Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did
and get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't
negative by any means!!!
Tiki take has won three UCL titles, Two Euro's and a World Cup in the
last 6/7 years, no argument can be made against it's successfulness!!!

I think Bayern fell asleep against Arsenal to be fair. Remember Arsenal
occasionally gave Barca a hard time too when the tiki takars used to take
things for granted!

Jellore

2013-04-24 05:07:49 UTC

Post by Abubakr

Ok, but quality can win regardless of tiki taka, like Bayern and RM do.
Yes, it is possible to win without tika taka. It's possible to win
without even much "quality" let alone tiki taka. What kind of drugs
are you on, seriously?

It would have been a complete waste of time if Bayern don't go on and
win it... Barce have won three times since 06, they have nothing to
prove with the way they play!!!
Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did
and get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't
negative by any means!!!
Tiki take has won three UCL titles, Two Euro's and a World Cup in the
last 6/7 years, no argument can be made against it's successfulness!!!

I think Bayern fell asleep against Arsenal to be fair. Remember Arsenal
occasionally gave Barca a hard time too when the tiki takars used to take
things for granted!

At the end of the day Arsenal were unlucky to lose the tie. Away goals
never a good way to go out, much like a penalty shoot out.

The Scrutineer

2013-04-24 05:20:19 UTC

Post by Abubakr
I think Bayern fell asleep against Arsenal to be fair. Remember Arsenal
occasionally gave Barca a hard time too when the tiki takars used to take
things for granted!
At the end of the day Arsenal were unlucky to lose the tie. Away goals
never a good way to go out, much like a penalty shoot out.

The PSG 3-3 Barce was worse...

In all honesty, Bayern were the better side overall, so the better team went
through, but with the exception of 20 rubbish shots from range and one
Robben run, Arsenal did it kind of easy in Munich... I don't think Bayern
fell asleep, they worked hard and took advantage of the space Arsenal left
them in midfield, they just got relatively easily beaten somehow...

Now if Arsenal can do it, why couldn't Barcelona (so far) and Juventus?
Barce have nothing to lose now, if anyone can do it, it's them!!!

Abubakr

2013-04-24 06:13:11 UTC

The PSG 3-3 Barce was worse...
In all honesty, Bayern were the better side overall, so the better team
went through, but with the exception of 20 rubbish shots from range and
one Robben run, Arsenal did it kind of easy in Munich... I don't think
Bayern fell asleep, they worked hard and took advantage of the space
Arsenal left them in midfield, they just got relatively easily beaten
somehow...

I think fell asleep might not be right the term. Better is "was trying
very hard to be super duper competitive after the result of the first
leg". Once you start matches in such a mind frame it's hard to adjust when
you are suddenly under some pressure.

Post by The Scrutineer
Now if Arsenal can do it, why couldn't Barcelona (so far) and Juventus?
Barce have nothing to lose now, if anyone can do it, it's them!!!

Because Bayern brought their A game to the semis, obviously.

Jellore

2013-04-24 08:36:58 UTC

The PSG 3-3 Barce was worse...
In all honesty, Bayern were the better side overall, so the better team went
through, but with the exception of 20 rubbish shots from range and one
Robben run, Arsenal did it kind of easy in Munich... I don't think Bayern
fell asleep, they worked hard and took advantage of the space Arsenal left
them in midfield, they just got relatively easily beaten somehow...
Now if Arsenal can do it, why couldn't Barcelona (so far) and Juventus?
Barce have nothing to lose now, if anyone can do it, it's them!!!

I agree Bayern were the better team, however at the end of day Arsenal
were still unlucky to lose. Bayern are now firm favourites to progress
however zi don't think it's a done deal. Barca at their best are
capable of scoring 4 at home.

mehdi

2013-04-24 16:47:47 UTC

Post by The Scrutineer
The PSG 3-3 Barce was worse...
In all honesty, Bayern were the better side overall, so the better team
went through, but with the exception of 20 rubbish shots from range and
one Robben run, Arsenal did it kind of easy in Munich... I don't think
Bayern fell asleep, they worked hard and took advantage of the space
Arsenal left them in midfield, they just got relatively easily beaten
somehow...
Now if Arsenal can do it, why couldn't Barcelona (so far) and Juventus?
Barce have nothing to lose now, if anyone can do it, it's them!!!

FFS. The only reason Arsenal won Munich is because Bayern saw them as
the joke they are and didn't see them as a credible threat. They will
not make the same mistake against Barcelona.

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Jellore

2013-04-24 05:06:01 UTC

It would have been a complete waste of time if Bayern don't go on and win
it... Barce have won three times since 06, they have nothing to prove with
the way they play!!!
Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did and
get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't negative
by any means!!!
Tiki take has won three UCL titles, Two Euro's and a World Cup in the last
6/7 years, no argument can be made against it's successfulness!!!

I think that was the point of my post upthread.

Diabolik

2013-04-24 06:40:59 UTC

It would have been a complete waste of time if Bayern don't go on and win
it... Barce have won three times since 06, they have nothing to prove with
the way they play!!!
Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did and
get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't negative
by any means!!!
Tiki take has won three UCL titles, Two Euro's and a World Cup in the last
6/7 years, no argument can be made against it's successfulness!!!
I think that was the point of my post upthread.

My point is, would Barca have won those trophies by playing football like
every other team?

They have the best footballers, it's not as if they have a standard team,
the same with Spain.

Diabolik

2013-04-24 06:42:57 UTC

Ok, but quality can win regardless of tiki taka, like Bayern and RM do.
Yes, it is possible to win without tika taka. It's possible to win
without even much "quality" let alone tiki taka. What kind of drugs are
you on, seriously?

It would have been a complete waste of time if Bayern don't go on and win
it... Barce have won three times since 06, they have nothing to prove with
the way they play!!!
Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did
and get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't
negative by any means!!!
Tiki take has won three UCL titles, Two Euro's and a World Cup in the last
6/7 years, no argument can be made against it's successfulness!!!

Would Barca and Spain have won those trophies by playing football like every
other team?

They have the best footballers, it's not as if they have a standard team,
the same with Spain.

How do you know it's Tiki taka football that won those games?

Bruce D. Scott

2013-04-24 10:33:34 UTC

The Scrutineer <***@bigpond.com> wrote:

|> Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did and
|> get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't negative
|> by any means!!!

It wasn't a record, since we lost like that (and more demoralisingly) to
AC Milan at home and 0-4 to Barca away.

--
ciao,
Bruce

drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/

The Scrutineer

2013-04-24 10:54:34 UTC

"Bruce D. Scott" wrote in message news:kl8cdu$124$***@gwdu112.gwdg.de...

The Scrutineer <***@bigpond.com> wrote:

|> Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did
and
|> get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't
negative
|> by any means!!!

Post by Bruce D. Scott
It wasn't a record, since we lost like that (and more demoralisingly) to
AC Milan at home and 0-4 to Barca away.

I'll stand corrected, I thought it was, what's your record defeat at home in
the UCL?

The Scrutineer

2013-04-24 11:02:26 UTC

"The Scrutineer" wrote in message news:kl8dfg$s3h$***@dont-email.me...

"Bruce D. Scott" wrote in message news:kl8cdu$124$***@gwdu112.gwdg.de...

The Scrutineer <***@bigpond.com> wrote:

|> Arsenal handed Bayern a record defeat, anyone can play like Arsenal did
and
|> get the result, I'm surprised nobody has done it since... it wasn't
negative
|> by any means!!!

Post by Bruce D. Scott
It wasn't a record, since we lost like that (and more demoralisingly) to
AC Milan at home and 0-4 to Barca away.
I'll stand corrected, I thought it was, what's your record defeat at home
in the UCL?

Milan beat you 2-0 in Munich in the 2006/07 season, so far it's a shared
record (I'm still searching despite this being completely pointless), it
would be impressive (in a way) that the worst defeat you suffered at the
highest level is only 2-0, and against a giant in Milan, and a respectable
opponent in Arsenal...

Bruce D. Scott

2013-04-24 12:02:55 UTC

The Scrutineer <***@bigpond.com> wrote:

|> I'll stand corrected, I thought it was, what's your record defeat at home in
|> the UCL?

I'm not sure... it could be 0-2 but I'm guessing higher. I was at the
0-2 to Milan after we'd drawn them 2-2 away and I really thought we
could lance that beast (was 5 to 7 years ago). I found some sites
saying "Arsenal must deal Bayern worst CL home loss in history" to reach
the next round so it appears 0-3 would have been the sole record. So it
looks like you tied it at 0-2.

--
ciao,
Bruce

drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/

The Scrutineer

2013-04-24 12:35:00 UTC

"Bruce D. Scott" wrote in message news:kl8hlf$7k5$***@gwdu112.gwdg.de...

|> I'll stand corrected, I thought it was, what's your record defeat at home
in
|> the UCL?

Post by Bruce D. Scott
I'm not sure... it could be 0-2 but I'm guessing higher. I was at the
0-2 to Milan after we'd drawn them 2-2 away and I really thought we
could lance that beast (was 5 to 7 years ago). I found some sites
saying "Arsenal must deal Bayern worst CL home loss in history" to reach
the next round so it appears 0-3 would have been the sole record. So it
looks like you tied it at 0-2.

For my satisfaction (grasping for something positive surrounding Arsenal
this season), lets make it a lone record!!!

:-P

I also stumbled across a few others interesting records/results...

Bayern 0-7 Schalke (1976)
Bayern 1-2 Norwich (1993) WTF???
Bayern 11-1 Dortmund (1971)

The only game Bayern have failed to score in this season was to Arsenal...
3-1 defeat to BATE in the group stage, I forgot about that one... and who
did Bayern lose their sole match in the league to this season?

Bruce D. Scott

2013-04-24 14:49:00 UTC

The Scrutineer <***@bigpond.com> wrote:

|> I also stumbled across a few others interesting records/results...
|>
|> Bayern 0-7 Schalke (1976)

That's one of the first games I ever saw :-)

|> Bayern 1-2 Norwich (1993) WTF???

I missed this one... must have been UEFA Cup. I thought 1993 was the
year we lost at home to Inter but then won it away... look it up on
rsssf.com

|> Bayern 11-1 Dortmund (1971)

Too much before my time.

The highest UEFA-cup win was 10-0 or something against a Cyprus team...

|> The only game Bayern have failed to score in this season was to Arsenal...

Right, first scoreless since 0-0 at home to Mainz last season

|> 3-1 defeat to BATE in the group stage, I forgot about that one... and who
|> did Bayern lose their sole match in the league to this season?

1-2 at home to Leverkusen, we had the play, they the goals. It's one
loss and three draws and the rest wins, so far in the league.

--
ciao,
Bruce

drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/

Abubakr

2013-04-24 04:51:49 UTC

Post by Alkamista

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

You need quality to be able to play tiki taka.

Of course. As if any tom dick and harry can do tika taka.

Tika taka is the natural result when players of the highest technical
skill come together in a team and have built understanding between each
other. All teams dotted with technical players do tiki taka in their own
way, i.e. keeping the ball off opponents when under pressure or starting
off attacking moves with a plethora of one touch passing and precise
movement off the ball. The Milan of 92/93 were capable of some exquisite
interplay with one touch passing and they also had the pressing game.

What Barcelona have done is to systematise the whole process and build up
very definite patterns and movements for the whole thing. When they do it
at their best, they were greatest most effective football team that has
ever existed.

And to bring up Bayern, of course have been trying to emulate the Barca
way themselves for a while now. Against every other team bar Barcelona,
they do it pretty successfully. Nobody can out tiki taka Barca themselves
so Bayern resorted to a more pragmatic counter attacking style.

Diabolik

2013-04-24 11:35:25 UTC

Post by Abubakr

Post by Alkamista

Post by Diabolik
Some figures in the Bayern vs Barca game.
Bayern 34% - Barca 66%
Shots: Bayern 15 - Barca 4
Goals: Bayern - Barca 4 -0
Does tiki taka football win games, or the quality of players?

You need quality to be able to play tiki taka.

Of course. As if any tom dick and harry can do tika taka.
Tika taka is the natural result when players of the highest technical
skill come together in a team and have built understanding between each
other. All teams dotted with technical players do tiki taka in their own
way, i.e. keeping the ball off opponents when under pressure or starting
off attacking moves with a plethora of one touch passing and precise
movement off the ball. The Milan of 92/93 were capable of some exquisite
interplay with one touch passing and they also had the pressing game.
What Barcelona have done is to systematise the whole process and build up
very definite patterns and movements for the whole thing. When they do it
at their best, they were greatest most effective football team that has
ever existed.
And to bring up Bayern, of course have been trying to emulate the Barca
way themselves for a while now. Against every other team bar Barcelona,
they do it pretty successfully. Nobody can out tiki taka Barca themselves
so Bayern resorted to a more pragmatic counter attacking style.

Ahh right. So if Barca play counter attacking football like Bayern
*allegedly* did, will they still win trophies because they have quality
players?

mehdi

2013-04-24 16:20:49 UTC

Post by Alkamista
You need quality to be able to play tiki taka.

You need the robotic brainwashing to pass the ball in such a tedious
manner. Messi, Xavi and Iniesta are exempt, they have more to their
games than the square pass. The rest of the team square pass the
opposition into boredom and they do something special when they have the
ball.

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Alkamista

2013-04-24 17:36:34 UTC

Post by mehdi

Post by Alkamista
You need quality to be able to play tiki taka.

You need the robotic brainwashing to pass the ball in such a tedious
manner. Messi, Xavi and Iniesta are exempt, they have more to their
games than the square pass.

I won't dispute the tedium of tiki taka at times but you need
intelligence and superb off the ball movement of make it work.
Liverpool have been trying a variety of it for a whole season and are
still struggling to adapt because they simply don't have the quality.

Bruce D. Scott

2013-04-24 10:31:35 UTC

--
ciao,
Bruce

drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/

Jordi

2013-04-24 10:34:13 UTC

I'm disappointed. It took you a good 4 hours after the match to write the usual rubbish.

It's only excusable if you were celebrating it via ingestion of copious amounts of (preferably bavarian) beer.

Diabolik

2013-04-24 11:15:44 UTC

Post by Jordi
I'm disappointed. It took you a good 4 hours after the match to write the usual rubbish.

I thought you would be intelligent enough to understand;)

Barca - 66% Possession *ZERO* goals;)

The Scrutineer

2013-04-24 11:21:19 UTC